Debt free! Until debt is created for you, ask the Greeks!
Pretty well all greeks were debt free before the crisis. This is because no greek bank offered credit cards, except to the wealthy (and these were instantly cancelled if an account dipped below 50,000 euros, even for a few minutes), nor is there such a thing as a mortgage or personal loan. Thus almost all property is owned outright and the question of personal credit ratings is unknown.
Tax on property pre-crisis was exacted through the municipality. If there was a second property tax was paid to the state. Come the crisis a new tax was placed on the first property, THUS double taxed.
Greek housing was constructed by greek families or collectively for apartments. Unable to pay the tax....confiscation follows.
Solidarity with the migrants, solidarity with Ukraine, solidarity with Covid and natural disaster victims (fire, earthquake, floods)! A special "tax' of 600 euros per annum per household per special 'solidarity' exacted, paid in "doses" by most households since the average salary is 700 per month. These taxes do not go away but are reduced over time so that about 17% of monthly income is exacted by the state. Meanwhile water and electricity bills triple and quadruple and are paid in "doses". Food doubles.
My aunt dies and I inherit her flat, worth 230k. Am forced to sell it since I cannot afford the new inheritance tax of 75,000 euros to be paid within 6 months of the probate. Six years later I'm hit with a bill of 8k by the state for the furnishins of the flat. No government official visited the flat, it could have been empty. But if I don't pay this bill, my own home will be confiscated, sold and whateveris left over from the 8k deduction will not be returned to me. ie there is no reduction.
I'm sorry, Eleni. Most Americans are in debt and are paying a lot of debt service, so it is atypical here to be out of debt, and likely safer, in the short term. You were all badly misused, whereas Americans have been more subtly misused. I expect that to change, but I expect a lot of changes.
My comment was apropos PCR's prognostications. Being debt free through non availability of borrowing saved the Greeks under the faked up "crisis" looting, which worsens every year. Western Europe has the same modern banking arrangements as the USA ("systemic") and the populations are drowning in terrifying debt ie mortgages, credit cards, car payments etc.....after having been repeatedly raped by the IMF, the Eurogroup and Germany, Greeks look at their situation with horror and sympathy.
Meanwhile 14 years have passed of the ever spiralling Greek crisis, salaries have been cut in half and 3/4s and most people's savings are by now gone. Pensions have been reduced 13 times to ridiculous payments like 120 euros a month. Basically 95% of greeks live in poverty. Yet "they" still find ways to indebt the debtless. A sad world when such petty sums can bring families down. However it's clear that "they" aren't pulling the plug entirely since Greece is rich Europeans No.1 holiday destination and "they" need the country to function somewhat....
I am looking at your experience as being part of our future, though systems also break, particularly since everything is electronic/online, and hugely vulnerable now.
I'm on the wrong edition, but I loved the photo of the banana tree! I know some people in northern Maine were growing various banana types in a greenhouse; easier with the small ones? which I first saw in the Floating Market in Bangkok. In Singapore we visited an orchid farm which had bananas growing because the orchids were fed with coconut milk, mashed banana, and tomatoes! An orchid grower in the UK asked me how they kept the mold at bay, but I had no idea other than that these orchids were very coddled and well-tended.
The Nam Wah and Orinoco are cooking bananas. I am not growing any plantains, nor have I ever cooked (real) plantains. I just have not cut down the bunches of green bananas before freezes... I don't feel like trying. I still miss Hawaii.
Move here for a Maine winter and then you'll miss Texas! (I am deeply thankful whenever we get a hit of an old-time winter, keeps the tourists from thinking of moving here. My God! that sounds like Hawaiians!)
Digital ID's mean:
There is nowhere left to hide...
Digital Currencies mean:
There is nowhere left to hide...
Debt free! Until debt is created for you, ask the Greeks!
Pretty well all greeks were debt free before the crisis. This is because no greek bank offered credit cards, except to the wealthy (and these were instantly cancelled if an account dipped below 50,000 euros, even for a few minutes), nor is there such a thing as a mortgage or personal loan. Thus almost all property is owned outright and the question of personal credit ratings is unknown.
Tax on property pre-crisis was exacted through the municipality. If there was a second property tax was paid to the state. Come the crisis a new tax was placed on the first property, THUS double taxed.
Greek housing was constructed by greek families or collectively for apartments. Unable to pay the tax....confiscation follows.
Solidarity with the migrants, solidarity with Ukraine, solidarity with Covid and natural disaster victims (fire, earthquake, floods)! A special "tax' of 600 euros per annum per household per special 'solidarity' exacted, paid in "doses" by most households since the average salary is 700 per month. These taxes do not go away but are reduced over time so that about 17% of monthly income is exacted by the state. Meanwhile water and electricity bills triple and quadruple and are paid in "doses". Food doubles.
My aunt dies and I inherit her flat, worth 230k. Am forced to sell it since I cannot afford the new inheritance tax of 75,000 euros to be paid within 6 months of the probate. Six years later I'm hit with a bill of 8k by the state for the furnishins of the flat. No government official visited the flat, it could have been empty. But if I don't pay this bill, my own home will be confiscated, sold and whateveris left over from the 8k deduction will not be returned to me. ie there is no reduction.
Not only lawfare but taxfare!
I'm sorry, Eleni. Most Americans are in debt and are paying a lot of debt service, so it is atypical here to be out of debt, and likely safer, in the short term. You were all badly misused, whereas Americans have been more subtly misused. I expect that to change, but I expect a lot of changes.
;-(
My comment was apropos PCR's prognostications. Being debt free through non availability of borrowing saved the Greeks under the faked up "crisis" looting, which worsens every year. Western Europe has the same modern banking arrangements as the USA ("systemic") and the populations are drowning in terrifying debt ie mortgages, credit cards, car payments etc.....after having been repeatedly raped by the IMF, the Eurogroup and Germany, Greeks look at their situation with horror and sympathy.
Meanwhile 14 years have passed of the ever spiralling Greek crisis, salaries have been cut in half and 3/4s and most people's savings are by now gone. Pensions have been reduced 13 times to ridiculous payments like 120 euros a month. Basically 95% of greeks live in poverty. Yet "they" still find ways to indebt the debtless. A sad world when such petty sums can bring families down. However it's clear that "they" aren't pulling the plug entirely since Greece is rich Europeans No.1 holiday destination and "they" need the country to function somewhat....
I am looking at your experience as being part of our future, though systems also break, particularly since everything is electronic/online, and hugely vulnerable now.
"everything is electronic/online, and hugely vulnerable now."
Exactly so and who knows but that might save us! Call us crazy but most greeks are hoarding their coins - any old coins! - with an eye to the future.
We have the same feeling about electronic failure "saving humanity" as a scenario, which may even be likely.
;-(
I'm on the wrong edition, but I loved the photo of the banana tree! I know some people in northern Maine were growing various banana types in a greenhouse; easier with the small ones? which I first saw in the Floating Market in Bangkok. In Singapore we visited an orchid farm which had bananas growing because the orchids were fed with coconut milk, mashed banana, and tomatoes! An orchid grower in the UK asked me how they kept the mold at bay, but I had no idea other than that these orchids were very coddled and well-tended.
Thai Nam Wah bananas are one of the varieties. We get bunches of green bananas, but the winter hard-freezes kill them.
Can you use the green bananas like plantains?
The Nam Wah and Orinoco are cooking bananas. I am not growing any plantains, nor have I ever cooked (real) plantains. I just have not cut down the bunches of green bananas before freezes... I don't feel like trying. I still miss Hawaii.
;-(
Move here for a Maine winter and then you'll miss Texas! (I am deeply thankful whenever we get a hit of an old-time winter, keeps the tourists from thinking of moving here. My God! that sounds like Hawaiians!)
Hawaiians plan to eat the Haolis when the ships stop bringing stuff to Costco.